Monday, February 11, 2008

Just Some Discussion about WWII

Below is a post by myself, a friendly comment by a person who gets it and understands history, and then a confirming follow up by myself. I hope the reader reads it all and enjoys any new info gleaned from it.




seang200 February 11th 2008 07:15 AM

Hitler and Occultism


The first Swastika known to show up in Germany:
(Do images work?)


Photobucket

  • For example: Nietzsche, also like Jorg Lanz Von Liebenfels (more later) was dubbed the “Father of National Socialism,” Nietzsche is probably more deserving of this distinction, being so labeled by Nazi luminaries Dr. Alfred Rosenberg and Dr. Frank. Others have called him the “Father of Fascism.” Rabidly anti-Christian and a homosexual, Nietzsche founded the “God is dead” movement and contributed to the development of existentialist philosophy. Nietzsche’s publisher, Peter Gast, called Nietzsche “one of the fiercest anti-Christians and atheists.”

    Nietzsche never married, and had no known female sex partners, but went insane at age 44 from syphilis and eventually died of it. According to Sigmund Freud and Carl Jung, Nietzsche had caught the disease at a homosexual brothel in Genoa, Italy. [15]
Nazism came from these organizations, or from contemporary homosexual influences. The extended-arm “Seig Heil” salute, for example, was a ritual of the Wandervoegel (“Wandering Birds” or “Rovers”), a male youth society that became the German “equivalent” of the Boy Scouts. The Wandervoegel was started in the late 1800’s by a group of homosexual teenagers. Its first adult leader, Karl Fischer, called himself “der Fuehrer” (“the Leader”) [16]. Hans Blueher, a homosexual Nazi philosopher and important early member of the Wandervoegel, incited a sensation in 1912 with the publication of The German Wandervoegel Movement as an Erotic Phenomenon, which told how the movement had become one in which young boys could be introduced into the homosexual lifestyle [17]. The Wandervoegel and other youth organizations were later merged into the Hitler Youth, which itself became known among the populace as the “Homo Youth” because of rampant homosexuality [18].

Many of the Nazi emblems, such as the swastika, the double lightning bolt “SS” symbol, and even the inverted triangle symbol used to identify classes of prisoners in the concentration camps, originated among homosexual occultists in Germany (some, such as the swastika, are actually quite ancient symbols which were merely revived by these homosexual groups). In 1907, Jorg Lanz Von Liebenfels (Lanz), a former Cistercian monk whom the church excommunicated because of his homosexual activities [19], flew the swastika flag above his castle in Austria [20]. After his expulsion from the church, Lanz founded the Ordo Novi Templi (“Order of the New Temple”), which merged occultism with violent anti-Semitism. A 1958 study of Lanz called, “Der Mann der Hitler die Ideen gab” – or, “The Man Who Gave Hitler His Ideas” – by Austrian psychologist Wilhelm Daim, called Lanz the true “father” of National Socialism.

List, a close associate of Lanz, formed the Guido Von List Society in Vienna in 1904. The Guido Von List Society was accused of practicing a form of Hindu Tantrism, which featured sexual perversions in its rituals (the swastika is originally from India). A man named Aleister Crowley, who, according to Hitler biographer J. Sydney Jones, enjoyed “playing with black magic and little boys,” popularized this form of sexual perversion in occult circles [21]. List was “accused of being the Aleister Crowley of Vienna” [22]. Like Lanz, List was an occultist; he wrote several books on the magic principles of rune letters (from which he chose the “SS” symbol). In 1908, List “was unmasked as the leader of a blood brotherhood which went in for sexual perversion and substituted the swastika for the cross” [23]. The Nazis borrowed heavily from Lis’s occult theories and research. List also formed an elitist occult priesthood called the Armanen Order, to which Hitler himself may have belonged [24].

The Nazi dream of an Aryan super-race was adopted from an occult group called the Thule Society, founded in 1917 by followers of Lanz and List. The occult doctrine of the Thule Society held that the survivors of an ancient and highly developed lost civilization could endow Thule initiates with esoteric powers and wisdom. The initiates would use these powers to create a new race of Aryan supermen who would eliminate all “inferior” races.

Hitler dedicated his book, Mein Kampf, to Dietrich Eckart, one of the Thule Society’s inner circle and a former leading figure in the German Worker’s Party (when they met at the gay bar mentioned earlier) [25].
  • “…And among them I want also to count that man, one of the best, who devoted his life to the awakening of his, our people, in his writings and his thoughts…” [26]
After the above dedication, the notes in this edition of Mein Kampf read, “Dietrich Eckart was the spiritual founder of the National Socialist Party” [27]. The various occult groups mentioned above were outgrowths of the Theosophical Society, whose founder, Helen Petrovna Blavatsky, was a lesbian [28], and whose “bishop” was a notorious pederast Charles Leadbeater. Heinrich Himmler, head of the SS, was obsessed with Freemasonry [29], which is full of occultic influences and practices [30].

The dreaded SA Brownshirts or Sturmabteilung (“Storm Troopers”, the SA) were largely the creation of another homosexual, Gerhard Rossbach [31].
  • “…the SA, under its leader Ernst Rohm, was administered to a large extent by homosexuals. And elaborate pimping service had been developed to satisfy the appetites of Rohm and his cohort…” [32].
Rossbach, who historian Gruber says “was a open homosexual” [33], formed the Rossbachbund (“Rossbach Brotherhood”), a homosexual unit of the Freikorps (“Free Corps”). The Freikorps were independent inactive military reserve units, which became home to the hundreds of thousands of unemployed World War I veterans in Germany. Rossbach also formed a youth organization under the Rossbuchbund, calling it the Schilljugend (“Schill Youth”) [34]. Rossbach’s staff assistant, Lieutenant Edmund Heines, a pederast and murderer, was put in charge of the Schilljugend. The Rossbuchbund later changed its name to Storm Troopers (in honor of Wotan, the ancient German God of storms) [35]. It was Rossbach who seduced Hitler’s mentor, Ernst Roehm, into homosexuality. It was under Roehm’s leadership that the Brownshirts became notorious for brutality.

Footnotes from a larger post from many yearn ago… much of which is from Scott Lively’s work…


[15] Scott Lively, The Poisoned Stream: “Gay” Influence in Human History: volume one, Germany 1890-1945, Founders Publishing Corp.; Keizer: Oregon [1997]

[16] H. W. Koch, The Hitler Youth: Origins and Development 1922-1945, Stein & Day; New York [1976], p. 25f

[17] Frank Rector, The Nazi Extermination of Homosexuals, Stein & Day; New York [1981], p. 39f

[18] ibid., p. 52

[19] Dusty Sklar, The Nazis and the Occult, Dorset Press; New York [1989], p. 19

[20] Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke, The Occult Roots of Nazism: Secret Aryan Cults and their Influence on Nazi Ideology, New York University Press; New York [1985] p. 109

[21] J. Sydney Jones Hitler in Vienna 1907-1913, Stein & Day; New York [1983], p. 123

[22] ibid., p. 123

[23] Dusty Sklar, The Nazis and the Occult, Dorset Press; New York [1989], p. 23

[24] Robert G. L. Waite, The Psychopathic God Adolf Hitler, Signet Books; New York [1977], p. 91

[25] Wulf Schwarzwaller, The Unknown Hitler: His Private Life and Fortune, National Press Book; Washington D. C. [1989], p. 67

[26] Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, translated by Ralph Manheim: Houghton Mifflin; New York [1971], p.687

[27] Ibid.

[28] James Webb, The Occult Underground, Open Court Pub; LaSalle: Il. [1974], p. 94

[29] G. S. Graber, The History of the SS: A Chilling Look at the Most Terrifying Arm of the Nazi War Machine, David McKay Company; New York [1978], p. 81

[30] see: Andre Nataf, The Wordsworth Dictionary of the Occult, Wordsworth Refernce; France [1994], pp. 58-60; Texe Marrs, New Age Cults & Religions, Living Truth Publishers; Austin: TX [1990], pp. 199-203; Debra Lardie, Concise Dictionary of the Occult and New Age, Kregal Publishers; Grand Rapids: MI [2000], p. 108; D. Michael Quinn, Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Signature Books; Salt Lake City: UT [1998], “freemasonry,” index, p. 604

[31] Robert G. Waite, Vangaurd of Nazism: The Free Corps Movement in Postwar Germany 1918-1923, W. W. Norton & Company; New York [1969], p. 209

[32] G. S. Graber, The History of the SS: A Chilling Look at the Most Terrifying Arm of the Nazi War Machine, David McKay Company; New York [1978], p. 47

[33] Ibid, p. 33

[34] Robert G. Waite, Vangaurd of Nazism: The Free Corps Movement in Postwar Germany 1918-1923, W. W. Norton & Company; New York [1969], p. 210

[35] G. S. Graber, The History of the SS: A Chilling Look at the Most Terrifying Arm of the Nazi War Machine, David McKay Company; New York [1978], p. 33



damienl February 11th 2008 11:08 AM

Re: Hitler and Occultism
It's always interesting to see that many people use Hitler's public payment of lip-service to a kind of Christianity that was wholly alien to the true Gospel as evidence that `religion poisons everything'.

However, when Christians point out that Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot (all of whom were atheists) committed atrocities on par with Hitler's, they immediately dismiss it as a red herring since `their atheism was not what made them commit barbarous acts' (what about the fact that it makes utilitarianism and `might is right' acceptable ethical options, especially when they are compounded with the firm belief that the here and now is all that matters?).

It is of course pure hypocrisy: blaming Christianity for Hitler's actions is like rejecting human rights because some leaders in developing countries publicly extol their virtues but also condone torture and rape.

It's not what you say that counts but what you do and, using that standard, Hitler is definitely not a Christian.



seang200 February 11th 2008 04:12 PM

Re: Hitler and Occultism
Quote:

Originally posted by damienl (Post 2239914)

It's always interesting to see that many people use Hitler's public payment of lip-service to a kind of Christianity that was wholly alien to the true Gospel as evidence that `religion poisons everything'.

However, when Christians point out that Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot (all of whom were atheists) committed atrocities on par with Hitler's, they immediately dismiss it as a red herring since `their atheism was not what made them commit barbarous acts' (what about the fact that it makes utilitarianism and `might is right' acceptable ethical options, especially when they are compounded with the firm belief that the here and now is all that matters?).

It is of course pure hypocrisy: blaming Christianity for Hitler's actions is like rejecting human rights because some leaders in developing countries publicly extol their virtues but also condone torture and rape.

It's not what you say that counts but what you do and, using that standard, Hitler is definitely not a Christian.

That’s right! I love the zinger that D’Souza gave Hitchens when he said (roughly):
  • Atheists killed more people in three weeks than three-hundred years of inquisitions.

The main difference is is that nothing in naturalism says that what Hitler did was morally wrong. The third article in the Humanist Manifesto begins:
  • “We affirm that moral values derive their source from human experience. Ethics is autonomous and situational, needing no theological or ideological sanction. Ethics stems from human need and interest.”

Ethics stems from human need and interest. What are the ends of human needs? This brings to mind a topic from WWII in fact, let me explain further. If one has watched any number of History Channel documentaries or been taught about the beginnings of Nazism in history class, invariably one has read about the book burning that took place in Germany by the National Socialists that even made it to television sets here in the States. Typically this is as deep as the viewer goes into this event. But has anyone ever asked which books were burned?

This topic came up in an earlier conversation at another site between “John” and myself:

Quote:

The well-known book burning that was shown (via newsreel) here in the U.S. that occurred in Nazi Germany was that of the Sex Research Institute. This institute had extensive records on the sexual perversions of numerous Nazi leaders, many of whom had been under treatment there prior to the beginning of the Nazi regime. Treatment at the Sex Research Institute was required by the German courts for persons convicted of sex crimes. Ludwig L. Lenz, who worked at the Institute at the time of the raid, which was May 6, 1933, and it was on May 10th that the Nazi’s burned the books and files from that institution. Lenz managed to escape with his life, and later wrote of the incident:
  • “Why was it then, since we were completely non-party, that our purely scientific Institute was the first victim which fell to the new regime? The answer to this is simple…. We knew too much. It would be against medical principles to provide a list of the Nazi leaders and their perversions [but] …not ten percent of the men who, in 1933, took the fate of Germany into their hands, were sexually normal…. Our knowledge of such intimate secrets regarding members of the Nazi Party and other documentary material – we possessed about forty thousand confessions and biographical letters – was the cause of the complete and utter destruction of the Institute of Sexology.”

To wit, The Times carried the obituary of a man who had worked in turn as secretary to Britain’s Joint Intelligence Committee in World War II, a priest and an “unshockable and permissive” sex therapist. The obituary reported him as saying that “A perversion is only what someone perceives to be a perversion.”
So it is situational ethics typically that drive people to simply state for convenience sake that ethics stems from human need and interest. In the words of the Encyclopedia Americana, “Since there is no God, man is the creator of his own values.” The British author John Hick bluntly asserts, “There is no God; therefore no absolute values and no absolute laws.” Joseph Lewis in, The Bible Unmasked, says, “there is in reality no absolute standard by which we can judge… In the final analysis our guide in moral affairs should be what gives to the individual the greatest possible happiness.”

C. S. Lewis talked about this “privatized morality” and showed some of its weaknesses, two of which he identified with his usual clarity:

Quote:

In the first place, how do ethical standards come into being? In Lewis’s words, “The human mind has no more power of inventing a new value than of planting a new sun in the sky or a new color in the spectrum.”

Secondly, in the absence of absolutes, how can we talk of moral progress? As Lewis puts it, “if things can improve, this means that there must be some absolute standard of good above and outside the cosmic process towards which that process can approximate. There is no sense in talking of ‘becoming better’ if better means simply ‘what we are becoming’ – it is like congratulating yourself on reaching your destination and defining destination as ‘ the place you have reached.’”
Allan Bloom, in his book, The Closing of the American Mind, said that, “There is one thing a professor can be certain of. Almost every student entering the university believes, or says he believes, that truth is relative.” How did the college student get this way? Let us allow the Father of modern educational philosophy answer that, John Dewey: “There is no God and no soul. Hence, there are no needs for props of traditional religion. With dogma and creed excluded, then immutable [i.e. unchangeable] truth is also dead and buried. There is no room for fixed, natural law or permanent moral absolutes.”

In light of all this, I find it funny… hold on, that was the wrong word, how bout’ “perplexing”… when an atheist says that he is so because there is evil in this world (innocent children die, and the such). Again, C. S. Lewis makes my point for me when he was an atheist:
  • “My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust? If the whole show was bad and senseless from A to Z, so to speak, why did I, who was supposed to be part of the show, find myself in such violent reaction against it?… Thus in the very act of trying to prove that God did not exist – in other words, that the whole of reality was senseless – namely my idea of justice – was full of sense. Consequently, atheism turns out to be too simple. If the whole universe has no meaning, we should never have found out that it has no meaning.”

Lewis hit the nail on the head. In the absence of transcendent values, we are left floundering about as best we can… or, as Heidegger put it, “searching in the darkness for any scraps of meaning that might be found.” Ravi Zacharias rightly concludes, if atheism is true, “Thinking atoms discussing morality is absurd.” All this leads to what Jean-Paul Sartre called a “baseless base of values.” In other words, the person who takes this route finds himself in a world with particulars but no universals, relatives but no absolutes, valuations but no values.

So from Cristina Odone (Melrose Place) saying in the June 97’ Daily Telegraph that, “What’s right is what you feel,” to Ernest Hemingway’s creed: “What is moral is what you feel good after, and what is immoral is what you feel bad after,” all this does as a philosophy of evolutionary naturalism is create people who will try to enforce their “will and way” above others.

This is why the “Hitlers” and “Stalins” will always exist! When the moral imperatives of God are thrown to the wayside, it creates a power vacuum. This is why the atheist has no real way to say what is good or bad for any individual besides himself – objectively. This, I believe, drove Bertrand Russell to a solemn grave, and Nietzsche insane. In fact, it was Nietzsche who said that the consequences of the death of God would penetrate every avenue of life, and that this, in-and-of-itself, would be unbearable. Nietzsche went on to say, because God had died in the nineteenth century, there would be two direct results in the twentieth century. First, he prognosticated that the twentieth century would become the bloodiest century in history; and second, that a universal madness would break out.

He has been right on both counts. More people have been killed because of ideological differences, and destroyed on the battlefields of geo-political maneuvering in the name of naturalism in this century than the previous nineteen centuries of religious killing before it. Yes, non-God movements/governments have killed more people in one century than religion did in the first nineteen. Unfortunately we see this madness seeping into other areas of our society as well:
  • Newspapers in 1996-1997 reported two particularly shocking cases of infanticide. In one, a pair of eighteen-year-old college sweethearts delivered their baby in a hotel room, killed him, and left the body in a dumpster. In the other, an eighteen-year-old briefly left her high school prom to deliver her baby in a bathroom stall, left the infant dead in a garbage can and returned to the dance floor. Both events led to convictions for homicide.

Although these crimes were attributed to either a moral failure (personal or social) or to some form of mental pathology, Steven Pinker had a different explanation. Steven Pinker, professor of psychology at the Massachusetts Institute of Psychology and a leading popularizer of evolutionary psychology, says it is (the above murders of infant) a genetic imperative. Writing in the New York Times, Pinker argued that what he termed neonaticide (The killing of a baby on the day of its birth) is not attributable to mental illness because “it has been practiced and acceptable in most cultures throughout history.” Rather, he went on to say, a capacity for neonaticide is hard-wired into the maternal genes by our evolutionary history.

AHHhh! Naturalistic morals (relativism) have struck again! And the only individual to strike at the core of these horrors that materialists have inflicted on the twentieth century is the theist (the Jew and Christian). This is why the non-theist will always have the “Hitlers,” “Stalins,” and “Maos” in their worldview as acceptable to their moral theorizing. They cannot assert objectively – beyond themselves – that those persons are wrong, it would only be their personal preference speaking. Sorta’ like chocolate or vanilla ice cream, or, brownies with or without nuts, Hitler… or Mother Teresa. They (the relativist) are neutered in the political and moral spectrum, or, if they do choose to take a value-laden stance, they are doing so in direct violation of their own doctrines and dogmas, thus, self-refuting their own claims.

I will end with a poem to drive the above points home:
Quote:

If chance be the Father of all flesh,
disaster is his rainbow in the sky,
and when you hear…
  • State of Emergency!
  • Sniper Kills Ten!
  • Troops on Rampage!
  • Whites Go Looting!
  • Bomb Blasts School!…
It is but the sound of man worshiping his maker.


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:24 PM.