Friday, November 10, 2006


From A Debate Some Time Back

Jim Bo, please read the following. I know its long… but consider it homework for the propagandus misleadingus ..

Bush Lied

“Bush lied about Weapons of Mass Destruction,” this seems to be the general consensus that I hear from Democrats/Bush haters about Iraq. This consensus does not take into account the plethora of information from many sources about the weapons program in Iraq by Democrats themselves, and from the world’s intelligence organizations.

For example, if Bush lied about WMDs, then what did Clinton do when he said:

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."

~ President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

Or how about Madeline Albright, John F. Kerry, Ted Kennedy, and the like?

"Iraq is a long way from the USA but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."

~ Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Feb. 18, 1998

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."

~ Former Vice President Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."

~ Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct. 10, 2002

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation. And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction. So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real."

~ Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23, 2003

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."

~ Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."

~ Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."

~ Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."

~ Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

If Bush lied, then all these persons did as well. You really can't have it both ways. You can't say President Bush lied while Senator Kerry and others, who said the same thing, were being honest.

There is no one who has made a remotely persuasive case that Bush lied. The German, Russian, French, Israeli, British, Chinese and U.S. governments all agreed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction. The German evaluation was even more severe than America's estimates. They were convinced Saddam would have a nuclear weapon by 2005.

Apparently, bush, while being called a dunce or ignoramus by the left is so intelligently diabolical that he got every intelligence agency - not to mention every Democrat - to lie for him as well. So is Bush still the "dunce of the class," as the left paints him, or is he so intelligent that he fooled the world? Which is it? Or are both views partisan?

If Bush lied, then he must have known there were no weapons in Iraq. There is no such thing as a lie unless you know the truth. If you say you believe something to be true, and it ultimately becomes false, that's not called a "lie," that's called a "mistake" – a mistake made by the CIA (and the world) that was beyond the Bush's control.

However, if Bush truly lied, then he knew there were no WMDs. Why would he do such a thing? That is: knowingly hurt his presidential chances and legacy? If he would be so diabolical as to lie to us about such a thing, why on God's green earth didn't he plant weapons over there. I mean, he's already a liar, right? We have been trampling around over there for quite a while . . . why not plant a weapon or two to set his legacy right?

The logic from the left is woefully lacking! The argument collapses on itself. And when an argument, whether political, religious, scientific, or philosophical, collapses via its own premises and logic (assumed), it is illogical, at best, or a lie itself, at worst.

Now, Jim Bo, has logic, examples, and proof (in the form of the historical record) made you rethink your statement that: "So Bush didn't lie about them? You come from Planet Moron?"

I now wish to deal with your ~ Jim Bo s ~ assertion that "Even the diehards admit that they were never there."

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Legal? Or Illegal?

An aspect that I hear all too often in regards to our entry into Iraq is that it wasn't legal. Is this truly the case?

During the First Gulf War, after the allies chased Saddam out from the fifth country he illegally attacked during his "30-years reign," a cease-fire was brokered by the UN and signed by the United States (Bush Sr.) and Iraq (Saddam).

The cease-fire agreement stipulated that Saddam was to disarm within 45-days of the signing. If not, the war would resume. This is key to our discussion of the Second Gulf War.

Fast forward to the Second War, let us switch gears a bit and discuss WMDs. The phrase "Weapons of Mass Destruction" have a connotation of a military person turning a key that fires a fully operational ICBM (Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile) tipped with a nuclear warhead.

The real analogy should be understood as if you came home one day and found a chef dressed in his white smock replete with hat. In your kitchen you also find mixing spoons, flour, sugar, eggs, baking soda, vanilla, chocolate chips, and the like. You are right to assume that the chef is about to bake something. Just as the US and her allies in the Second Gulf War rightly assumed that Saddam hadn’t given up his WMD program.

Now let's discuss the actual phrase that the administration used to describe what was expected to be found. The words "Weapons of Mass Destruction" was, I believe, the biggest mistake the administration made in our understanding of what we were to find in Iraq. The phrase "Agents of Mass Destruction" (AMD) would have given the "Chef" analogy more legs to stand on.

And "AMDs" is what we found. That is - the chef, the ingredients, all the utensils, just no complete weapon.

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The above photograph is of chemical agents used in making AMDs. They were found with a chemist being hidden in a safe house in a suburb of Baghdad. These are the ingredients with the chef, if you will . . . now, where are the utensils?

Below is a photo of lab equipment hidden/found in a mosque, the equivalent to a church.

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These are just a few examples out of the many that show the legality of not a preemptive strike against Iraq, but a resumptive entry into Iraq.

The "war-of-words," however, was not well defined nor defended by this administration. Much to my chagrin.

All this is behind us now . . . however, clearing up an old cliché from the opposition is always relevant to proper thinking on the subject of Iraq.

I will end this subject with a rare but frank admission from the Daily News about Iraq's continued violations of the UN’s resolutions

{Parts of the following are from:">David Kay's report on Iraqi WMDs; Also, Daily News - Sunday Viewpoint, "Altered Reality: Look Past The Dogma and You'll See the WMDs" (October 26, 2003), p. 3}:

>>>> A clandestine network of laboratories and safe-houses within the Iraqi Intelligence Service that contained equipment subject to UN monitoring and suitable for continuing CBW research.

>>>> A prison laboratory complex, possibly used in human testing of BW agents, that Iraqi officials working to prepare for UN inspections were explicitly ordered not to declare to the UN.

>>>> Reference strains of biological organisms concealed in a scientist's home, one of which can be used to produce biological weapons.

>>>> New research on BW-applicable agents, Brucella and Congo Crimean Hemorrhagic Fever (CCHF), and continuing work on ricin and aflatoxin were not declared to the UN.

>>>> Documents and equipment, hidden in scientists' homes, that would have been useful in resuming uranium enrichment by centrifuge and electromagnetic isotope separation (EMIS).

>>>> A line of UAVs not fully declared at an undeclared production facility and an admission that they had tested one of their declared UAVs out to a range of 500 km, 350 km beyond the permissible limit.

>>>> Continuing covert capability to manufacture fuel propellant useful only for prohibited SCUD variant missiles, a capability that was maintained at least until the end of 2001 and that cooperating Iraqi scientists have said they were told to conceal from the UN.

>>>> Plans and advanced design work for new long-range missiles with ranges up to at least 1000 km - well beyond the 150 km range limit imposed by the UN. Missiles of a 1000 km range would have allowed Iraq to threaten targets through out the Middle East, including Ankara, Cairo, and Abu Dhabi.

>>>> Clandestine attempts between late-1999 and 2002 to obtain from North Korea technology related to 1,300 km range ballistic missiles --probably the No Dong -- 300 km range anti-ship cruise missiles, and other prohibited military equipment.


From: Disinformation: 22 Media Myths that Undermine the War on Terror:

>>>> Found: 1.77 metric tons of enriched uranium

>>>> Found: 1,500 gallons of chemical weapons

>>>> Found: Roadside bomb loaded with sarin gas

>>>> Found: 1,000 radioactive materials--ideal for radioactive dirty bombs

>>>> Found: 17 chemical warheads--some containing cyclosarin, a nerve agent five times more powerful than sarin

Updated More

>>>> 500 chemical shells, of which just 15 killed 5,000 people.